Dean's World

I have here a very interesting and cohesive thought pattern. If I am critical of George W. Bush, I am labeled anti-American. If I criticize Israel, I am labeled anti-Semite. If I criticize the Palistinians, I am a Zionist.

In the end, one is a victim of the classical propaganda techniques, generalizations and band wagoning. Forsooth!

Percival: I defy you to show me anyone who said that criticizing Bush makes you anti-American, that criticizing Israel makes you an anti-Semite, or that criticizing Palestinians makes you a Zionist. I never said or implied any such thing, nor did anyone that I'm aware of--and, that being the case, the only one who appears to be engaging in classical propaganda techniques is you.

Fraud!

Tom: After all the last Pope did to mend relations with the Jewish community, that really is disturbing.

It just gets grimmer when you read their explanation (if you haven't already).

Dean, as a jew who has been critical of Israel's actions at times, I can testify that the whole "self-hating jew" thing does get used to forestall such criticism. Writers are generally careful (nowadays, at least) not to make such asinine pronouncements, but there remain many debates that occur offline...

(Incidentally, in addition to being a self-hating jew, I'm also a self-hating catholic, not to mention a self-hating buddhist, skeptic, and atheist. And maybe a self-hating self-hater as well.)

For example: there is much concern on the part of these "progressives" about the bulldozers used by Israel to destroy buildings used by terrorists and to help erect Israel's defensive barrier.

Bulldozers are also being used, on a very large scale, by the Mugabe government in Zimbabwe, to destroy the houses of totally innocent but politically-inconvenient people. I have seen no denunciation of *these* bulldozers by the "progressives." Probably because:
a)They aren't driven by Jews
b)Their use can't be blamed on American foreign policy
c)They may not have been made by an American company

I'm not Jewish, unfortunately, so I can't be a self-loving or a self-hating Jew. I'm just a Gentile who hates Gentiles who hate Jews -- especially when they hide their Jew-hatred under the banner of "progressivism".

Photon Courier:

Absolutely right.

Martin Peretz wrote:
"In this, they are following the lead of the National Council of Churches bureaucracy which has been--how can we say this, diplomatically?--made historically quite edgy by the national renaissance of the Jewish people. (If you look at the NCC website, you'd be hard pressed to conclude that the organization was anything other than a political mobilization of the left and one, at that, rather blasé about Christianity.)..."

Conservative Christians such as Manning Johnson, J. B. Matthews, Verne Paul Kaub, Major Edgar C. Bundy, Rev. Carl MacIntire, E. Merrill Root, and many others have been sounding the warning since the 1940s (at least) against socialist and Communist infiltration in the National and World Councils of Churches. No wonder that many are leaving these bankrupt "modernist" churches and church councils, and the fundamental churches are growing.

It's a Vast Left-wing Conspiracy!

It is the lefties that say criticizing Bush makes them unAmerican. It's a crybaby tactic. They want to be able to say things freely without consequence. If they face any consequences they accuse their critics of calling them unAmerican.

I would imagine that the lefties are also boo hooing that people are calling them anti-semites. Not for criticizing Israel, mind you, but for actually being anti-semetic.

"And that's the weather. BTW, did you hear that 5 more Israelis died via a suicide bomber?" "Wow, that sucks". Back to you, Jim"

That's pretty much the way we handle things in Israel, except that no one is named "Jim".

Criticizing the President doesn't necessarily make you un-American. Criticizing our soldiers or otherwise undermining our War effort does make you un-American. I myself have often criticized President Bush for being too soft on our enemies. Saying that Bush is like Hitler or Saddam is just plain stupid. Criticizing the Israelis for defending themselves is anti-Jewish. Praising a Communist dictator like Castro makes you a Communist, and if my saying that makes me a McCarthyite or a Birchite, so be it.

Percival: Yes, you struck a very familiar chord--a tiresome, cliched one.

You're right in one sense: people who make your claim are extremely common on the internet. I find, however, that people who actually behave as you describe are quite rare.

You disagree? Then cite a specific example please. No generalizations, no equivocating. If it's so common, you should be able to do this with very little effort.

My prediction? You won't cite an example, because you can't.

Oh, by the way, another shopworn cliche? When someone challenges your assertions, you change the subject to their motives or their intelligence. It's a hoary old trick that anyone who's been on the internet for more than a few years knows well. It's almost always a sign of a weak position.

So. Examples, please?

Dean:

You provide your own data as follows:

"To: Reverend Clifton Kirkpatrick, Stated Clerk of the Presbyterian Church USA
The July 2004 General Assembly vote to divest the Church’s holdings in companies that do business in Israel is MORALLY WRONG. As Harvard University President Lawrence Summers said with regard to another effort to promote divestment from Israel, such actions "are anti-Semitic “in their effect, if not their intent.”

Rosemary wirtes:

"I would imagine that the lefties are also boo hooing that people are calling them anti-semites. Not for criticizing Israel, mind you, but for actually being anti-semetic."

There are more if I had the time.

It isn't the criticism of Israel or its policies that identifies one as an anti-Semite - it is the nature of the criticism. Most of the criticism has been leveled on the Israelis and has not been leveled on the Palestinians. A Palestinian murders a dozen people by blowing up a bus. The Israelis level his house. After the bombing there is a certain amount of tut-tuting and calls for the Israelis to show restraint and not perpetuate the cycle of violence. When the house is levelled, condemnation is loud.

When a sheik calls for the death of every Jew in Israel he is called a spiritual leader. When the Israelis send him to his spiritual reward on a hellfire missile, they are condemned for being provocative.

If these churches had decided to disinvest with any company that deals with either Israel or the Palestinians it would be even handed. Pontius Pilate even-handed, but even. When these churches divest from only Israel they are choosing sides, Herod-like.

I'm not dumb, they're anti-Semites. They just want some one else to do the job so that they can keep their consciences clear and their hands clean. They're fascist - Nazi apologists. But really well-mannered ones.