The Arab Muslims have seen the alternatives to Western-style Constitutional government or democracy close up enough and long enough so they know well enough what they wouldn't be missing if they switched over.
That was a very interesting questionnaire. I've seen that 2-dimensional spectrum before from the World Values survey. Somewhere, I have a chart of it printed out. As I recall, on the survival vs. self-expression values dimension, the United States was high on self-expression, and on secular vs. religious values, the United States was high on religious values.
What I find most enlightening is just how much more markedly these folks value secular rationalism and democracy than we do. Similar surveys recently have shown growing antipathy toward terrorism and religious extremism.
Something's gotta give. Blaming the Jews and the evil presence of American boots on Arab soil for all their woes is seeming less and less rational all the time to the people over there, and no wonder.
Come on, Dean, there is obviously something wrong with that study if it puts Western Europeans as valuing democracy more than the US. The influence of of the other countries that are grouped with the US might have some influence, but I'd say the most likely problem is the wording of the question. Many people will see it as critical of democracy: "Democracy may have problems...". Lots of conservative Americans are going to shut down right there: "Nuh uh! Democracy doesn't have any problems!"
No, it's not rational, but a question like that which makes both negative and positive evaluations of democracy in the same sentence is going to get some some "yes"s from some basically anti-democrats and some "no"s from pro-democrats. And who knows how it is going to come out in translation?
You are looking at peer-reviewed data and the way the questions are worded is clearly spelled out.
Given how many conservatives and libertarians here in the US blather about how dangerous the government is, how we are "a republic not a democracy," say things like "democracy is three wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch," and say that we're all going to hell in a handbasket because of the dangers of populism and liberalism, and how it is traditional culture and religious values that are important and NOT democracy, I don't find anything paricularly hard to believe about the results.
Oh, but in case you think I'm just picking on conservatives and libertarians, let's not forget all the lefties who prate about "participatory democracy" (i.e. anarchy) as better than our own democracy, about how liberal democracy is a sham, about how we're not better than China and Cuba and have much to learn from them, and so on. Or about our "sham democracy" that's "run by the corporate bosses."
No, democracy has tons of detractors here in posh, comfortable, liberal democratic America.
Steve: so, would you not agree with the statement that democracy is the best form of government there is?
Dean: I am one of those conservative critics of democracy, but I would still say that democracy is the best form of government there is (unless I was nitpicking the difference between a democracy and a republic, but I can't imagine doing that in answer to a poll).
As to the study, I don't think there is anything wrong with their stastistics, but I still maintain that the question they asked (which as you said, is right there in the paper) is not necessarily effective in answering the question of how much the respondent supports democracy.
All of these conservatives critics of democracy that you think answered the question in the negative must have in mind a form of government that they think is better than democracy. What would that government type be? If you are going to say a "republic", then I maintain that the poll was faulty for leading people to distinguish between two varieties of representative government and then reporting as though there were only one type.
That was a very interesting questionnaire. I've seen that 2-dimensional spectrum before from the World Values survey. Somewhere, I have a chart of it printed out. As I recall, on the survival vs. self-expression values dimension, the United States was high on self-expression, and on secular vs. religious values, the United States was high on religious values.
Something's gotta give. Blaming the Jews and the evil presence of American boots on Arab soil for all their woes is seeming less and less rational all the time to the people over there, and no wonder.
No, it's not rational, but a question like that which makes both negative and positive evaluations of democracy in the same sentence is going to get some some "yes"s from some basically anti-democrats and some "no"s from pro-democrats. And who knows how it is going to come out in translation?
Given how many conservatives and libertarians here in the US blather about how dangerous the government is, how we are "a republic not a democracy," say things like "democracy is three wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch," and say that we're all going to hell in a handbasket because of the dangers of populism and liberalism, and how it is traditional culture and religious values that are important and NOT democracy, I don't find anything paricularly hard to believe about the results.
No, democracy has tons of detractors here in posh, comfortable, liberal democratic America.
I stand with Admiral Ben Moreel back in the 1950s when he wrote of:
"1. God
2. individual sovereignty
3. limited government"
....in that order. No mention of "democracy".
Dean: I am one of those conservative critics of democracy, but I would still say that democracy is the best form of government there is (unless I was nitpicking the difference between a democracy and a republic, but I can't imagine doing that in answer to a poll).
As to the study, I don't think there is anything wrong with their stastistics, but I still maintain that the question they asked (which as you said, is right there in the paper) is not necessarily effective in answering the question of how much the respondent supports democracy.
All of these conservatives critics of democracy that you think answered the question in the negative must have in mind a form of government that they think is better than democracy. What would that government type be? If you are going to say a "republic", then I maintain that the poll was faulty for leading people to distinguish between two varieties of representative government and then reporting as though there were only one type.