Dean's World

Some recently expressed skepticism when I noted that country music and the blues originally came from the same place musically. I thought I'd illustrate the point with four songs from my personal collection, all recorded in the 1920s. They vary in sound quality but they were all recorded within a few years of each other and I think that if you listen closely you'll agree that they share more similarities stylistically than differences.

Skeptical? Okay: One of the below songs is considered by many to be the first country music "hit." Can you guess which one of the four it is?

Also, two of the songs were by white artists. Two were by black artists. (Note: You have to turn it up to hear the guitar on the third song, it's probably the poorest in terms of recording quality although it's not the oldest.)

Georgia Rag

Danville Girl

Prisoner's Song

How You Want It Done

Care to guess which are the white artists, and which are the black artists? I'm willing to bet that if you don't cheat, you'll guess wrong on at least a couple.

By the way, while I was digging out my collection of really-oldies, I rediscovered one of my all-time favorite artists, Blind Willie Johnson. Man, I can't get enough of this guy's stuff. Just for the heck of it, I threw in a couple of those, to make another interesting point:

When The War Was On

It's Nobody's Fault But Mine

Interestingly, Blind Willie did not consider himself a blues artist. He thought that was the devil's music. He was one of the early Gospel recording artists.

Shows you just how artificial the whole concept of putting music in "genres" really is, doesn't it?

(I wish I could find the lyrics to "When The War Was On." I hear him talking about saving sugar for the boys in France and President Wilson but I'd like to decipher the whole thing.)

Related Posts (on one page):

Blues & Country
Cowboy Troy

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DSmith (mail) (www):

Absolutely, by the 1920s there was a great deal of confluence in white and black (blues) country musics. But that's not when the roots of those musics were laid down, by a good 50 years or more. Trace back further, and it diverges. They are strongly related, no question, but they don't come from the same place.

6.2.2005 9:33pm

BTW, nice selections. :)

6.2.2005 9:42pm

Dean Esmay:

By the way, do you notice how similar "When The War Was On" is structurally to "Jailhouse Rock?"

6.2.2005 9:47pm

Ken McCracken (mail) (www):

I always hated labels in music - people will decide not to listen to Robert Johnson because they have already decided they don't like 'blues' for example.

I decided to try listening to opera, because I didn't know anyone who liked it or thought it was anything but a joke. Guess what? Opera rocks. I am a big Verdi fan now. There is lots of opera that I don't like and think is tedious, but I am not prejudiced against the genre as a whole.

Heh, I guess that means I need to delve into rap, because I am biased against it, but really I have not given it an honest listen.

6.2.2005 10:20pm

Try Dr. Dre. He's freaking awesome.

(I notice nobody so far has taken my "which was the country hit?" challenge, or my "which were the black artists?" challenge by the way...)

6.2.2005 10:43pm

Brainster (mail) (www):

I'll guess that Prisoner's Song is the hit.

6.3.2005 12:32am

Alan at TYL (www):

Country music can trace a lot of its roots back to Irish folk music. Many if the 19th century Irish immigrants ended up in New Orleans and then worked their way up the Mississippi into Tennessee and the surrounding areas. These immigrants often worked alongside blacks. The musics mingled. Blues, Bluegrass, Country and Rock all came out of this uniquely American combination of styles.

Gotta love history.

6.3.2005 12:36am

Casey Tompkins (mail) (www):

Smithy is positing a seperation where none exists.

In the PBS documentary, Rythm, Country, and Blues, one of the interviewed artists (forget which offhand) put it pretty well: "The black folks heard what the white folk were doin', and they liked it, and the white folk heard what the black folk were doin', and they liked that." Or to that effect. :)

There's no "one place" where it all came from, my good friend... :)

6.3.2005 4:56am

My argument is that "it came from the same place" in the sense that by the early 20th century there simply wasn't "black blues music" and "white country music," it was all just rural poor folk music. Some was classified as "black" and some "white" but only because of the performers themselves--stylistically, the differences were so tiny as to be pretty meaningless.

I'd say that the divergence came with the founding of the Grand Ole Opry, creating a very distinct white-people country music---and around the same time guys like T-Bone Walker and Muddy Waters started bringing a black urban sensibility to their audiences. It was around then I think that the two forms really start to become genuinely distinct from each other. Until then, really, they were so close as to make no never mind.

Even then the complete break took a while. I don't really see how anyone who liked old-school folk blues could fail to like Hank Williams Sr., just for example.

6.3.2005 5:23am

Oh and by the way, there were even black artists in the Grand Ole Opry when it first began. One of the founders was a black harp player named DeFord Bailey. But by the 60s that was pretty much a thing of the past, and black artists doing old school were all pretty much blues artists.

6.3.2005 5:26am

lindsey (mail):

"There's no "one place" where it all came from, my good friend... :)"

The American South? Or, if I'm going to be cheesy, maybe the human heart?

6.3.2005 6:01am

Andrew Ian Dodge (mail) (www):

I always described country music (traditional) as "white boy blues." I have not seen any reason not to continue describing it as such.

However New-Country (ie Shania Twain, Lonestar, Montgomery Gentry etc) is basically 70s/80s AOR/hard rock (ala Journey, Styx, Eagles, Kansas et al) done with slide guitar and a bit of fiddles. In fact many of these acts drop the "country elements" when they release music outside the US. Most of the top AOR/hard rock/pop rock songwriters like Jim Peterik and Dan Huff buggered off to Nashville as soon as grunge hit and continue to crank out hits.

6.3.2005 8:22am

Joel (No Pundit Intended) (mail) (www):

Dean,

You're right. 'Nuf said.

JG

6.3.2005 10:38am

Bithead (mail) (www):

I'll add a few comparisons;

*** Hank Williams, "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry".. particularly as done in '62 by BJ Thomas... Was it blues that started country, or country that stated as blues? To this day, I still don't know.

*** Greg Allman's "Midnight Rider". To my ears, a country tune... but heavy on the blues... it did well in all three circles... and what would you expect from a blues-rock fusion act?

**** The Amazing Rythm Aces.... (Russel Smith) "The End Is Not In Sight. Once again, a country tune to my ears, but rooted in the blues, I think. Smith, for those who don't know, was an early Mark Knopler, stylisticlly, though he lacked the full range of playing talent Kopler has. Still Smith was no slouch and a hell of a songwriter.

****Tony Joe White's tune "Rainy Night In Georgia", particularly as done by Brook Benton... one of the first songs ever recorded in the then newly-redesigned Studio B at the now- legendary Criteria Studios in Miami Florda. If you don't know, Tony Joe White is Bayou Bluesman... the grandfather of the southern blues sound, to my mind. Benton leaned the tune farther into the blues with that voice of his, and they had a number 1 record for the year. I've always said ith a decent vocalist, you could turn it into a country tune without stretching it outta shape, because given White's writing, it's actually BOTH. (Of course carrying the tune after Benton put his signiture on it would be hard, indeed.

These are but a few of the off the top examples that back your thinking on this subject, Dean.

6.3.2005 1:05pm

Speaing of Knopfler, two things race to mind:

"The Bug".. a decent Rock/Blues number, covered by a country artist.. Mary Chapin Carpenter. And does anyone think that tune isn't blues-structured?

Also, Knopfler, rumor has it, tried to get Country artist Vince Gill to join Dire Straights.... Vince turned the guy down, but hten went on to release "The Next Big Thing" which to my mind is a 50's blues-rock number.

Hmmm.

6.3.2005 2:11pm

J.J. Cale was the guy who Mark Knopfler most clearly sounds like, to my mind. But just listen to the guy: is he rock, is he country with a blues flavor, is he laid back rockabilly...?

I find that the most rewarding thing about discussing roots music is not necessarily trying to pin people down into genres (all such arguments are circular and endless) but instead it really opens your mind up to seeing various strains and influences (and, for the musician, endless possibilities).

I mean, was it odd that Rick Rubin resurrected Johnny Cash's career? Or did it just plain make sense? :-)

6.3.2005 4:44pm

I ended up with a fairly long post which I turned into a blog post. You can find the result here. Lots of link-love for everyone, including Alan, Andrew and Bithead. :) Feel free to link away... :)))

I agree very much with Dean that open possibilities are more important, and more intriguing, than nailing down definitions.

On somewhat similar lines, what if one of America's greatest guitar players (Jerry Reed) decided to do a tribute to Jim Croce?

That happened. Check out Amazon for Jerry Reed Does Jim Croce. Excellent production values and guitar work complement a fascinating interpretation of Croce's work...

6.4.2005 4:32am