Good Beliefnet Piece
Dean
Steven Waldman has a good piece on BeliefNet that more people should read: Perverted, God-Hating Frenchies vs. Inbred, Sex-Obsessed Yokels. It's pretty spot-on, in my experience.
There are a few nits I have to pick with it. A little known fact, for example, is that the 1st amendment to the U.S. Constitution was fought and argued for most passionately by southern Baptists, of the same basic background as guys like Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson. Indeed, the southern Baptists responsible for that amendment, back in the 1700s, were a very great deal more conservative and "intolerant" than guys like Falwell. They argued passionately for the 1st amendment precisely because separation of church & state was so important to them--and the funny thing is that if you listen closely enough to guys like Falwell and Robertson, they're still concerned about keeping the 1st amendment's separation of church and state. They simply feel that things like school prayer and the 10 commandments on a courthouse wall simply do not qualify as "church" or as "establishment of a religion"; to them it feels more like these are innocuous, non-sectarian traditions and that expunging them (especially by the courts rather than by democratic action) are an assault on them and an effort to remove their very presence from the public square. They often ask fair questions, such as, "Why was it okay for religious people to use their faith to oppose slavery, to oppose child labor practices, to oppose segregation--but if we oppose abortion we're endangering the Constitution?"
On the other hand, the conservative belief that people on the left instinctively reject morality is often off-base. Yes, there is a hedonist side to modern day leftists, no question about it, just as there is a rigid intolerance to some religious conservatives. But I'm often moved by just how concerned with private morality many people on the left really are, and how important raising good kids is to many of them.
Another nit: Waldman seems to join in the "kick Zell Miller" games that are so popular on the left these days. He ought to stop it. If I'd said that Ann Coulter has horns under her blonde hair no one would think me a religious zealot. Anyone who knows Zell Miller's record knows that he's a lifelong liberal on most social issues and not a conservative by most measures at all.
I think the #1 thing that really contributes to the left/right divide, at least on matters of faith, is that conservatives tend to feel they are completely ganged up on by the popular culture. It recently occurred to me that this is pretty much what a lot of black people feel about white culture: that the majority people can't understand them because they didn't grow up exposed to minority culture except through the broad brush strokes of popular music and comedians--but black people can't help but understand white culture pretty well since they're so overwhelmed by it on television, in movies, and so on.
There's probably a great deal of truth to that. As someone who's spent a whole lot of time living and working among black people (which gets me in trouble sometimes since it's taught me to be blunt about race issues in a way that sometimes gives other people the willies), I've seen it in action. Although some black people take that "you can't undestand" stuff to a ridiculous level, there's some truth there. If you grow up talking a little different, dressing a little different, eating a little different, playing a little different from the dominant culture, it's easier for you to be stereotyped and misunderstood.
Similarly, the truth is that if you look at television, movies, what's found in most school textbooks, and certainly the dominant culture at most of our more prestigious universities, it's so far from what most religious conservatives grow up thinking and believing and sharing with each other it's almost like a different universe. The "Red Staters" understand the New York, Hollywood, and intellectual culture that dominates the television and movie industries quite well because they can't help but suck it in on a daily basis. Hollywood is dominated by Californians and people from the Boston-New York corridor, as are the upper echelons of the news industry. "Blue staters," however, are so underexposed to what people in the heartland think and feel they often stereotype them or make ridiculous assumptions about them. This is why, as paradoxical as it seems, many self-described conservatives feel that they are constantly fighting an uphill struggle politically even when they win victory after victory at the polls.
In recent years I've come to appreciate how and why my own values and viewpoints seem so odd to some people. I used to think it was because I was just naturally iconoclastic. Recently I've come to realize, though, that I had a rather schizoid upbringing. I grew up with one foot solidly in west Texas and another in urban Chicago. I grew up partly in rock-ribbed fundamentalism and partly in liberal protestantism, with a year in a Catholic school to round all that out--then turned atheist. All of these have come to inform my own political views.
I fancy that the red staters understand the blue staters better than the reverse. They really do seem to. But then they get some wild ideas about them and make some crazy generalizations that simply aren't so. On the other hand if I hear one more blue stater rant about how the Republicans are about to impose a radical theocracy on the nation I think my head will explode.
What the solution to all this is I don't know. I do know that more articles like Waldman's would be a start. I kind of liked this Max Lucado piece too, although I fancy a lot of people will look at it and not know what he's talking about.









I generally consider myself to be a conservative/libertarian type, or perhaps a classical liberal, but I work with a bunch of people who are securely on the left to varying degrees. The ironic thing is, I'm generally an agnostic, leaning toward atheism, and I voted for Bush. The Kerry voters in my office include two Catholics who send their children to Catholic school and two Baptists who attend church weekly. Most of the people I know who voted for Bush rarely attend church. I personally have no disdain for religious people, and often admire their faith even if I don't share it. Ironically, many of the people I know who do consider themselves religious seem to have greater disdain for other religious people than I do.
Anyway, my experience might not be all that widespread or common, but whenever I hear people talk as if all us Bush voters want to install a theocracy, it drives me nuts.
New England is unique in that it's almost all "blue", yet it's the last place in America with vestiges of puritanism. When I grew up in Connecticut in the 70's and 80's, stores were all closed on Sunday. Massachusetts now allows Sunday liquor sales...a law we passed in 2003! So I always find it odd when blue state liberals fear a red state "theocracy", since the places where religion is most ingrained in the customs, history and local government are often blue states.
"And by the way, I had really liberal views before I moved to California. And yes, its nice to live in an area where people are progressive minded and
idealistic. The realities of Bush's (besides a few wealthy people like you and my dad) side is that they tend to be uneducated, gun toting, religious radicals, anti-environmental. etc
Kerry is a phony, but so what? Bush has already been totally disastrous for this country, he's a liar, a thief and he whimsically destroys human life everyday in Iraq. His party let the assault weapons ban expire. He sat reading a book about a goat to 10 year olds while our country was under
attack. Americans are now hated around the world because of him."
Here,I with my brother who are 40 years older and presumably wiser and dear nephew whom we love is informing us of the virtues of liberalism.
Only in 'Amurica'. And its nice to know, I'm wealthy--it's the first I've heard about it.
They honestly believe that twaddle, they refuse to question it, and they refuse to honestly consider alternative explanations offered by a Bush Supporter.
I had a numerous uncles there. All were registered Democrats, as was most of the region. One of them, who was a state policeman, had the reddest neck I'd ever seen. His views of morality were so far to the right that I was usually left speachless when he got on a rant. But he voted DEM every time he stepped into a voting booth. Even when he ran for political office, it was as a DEM. And he was elected as a DEM.
And of course, his flavor of Democrat was vastly different from that found in NYC or Hollywood. He was all for racial equality, unions, fair pay and working conditions, economically "progressive" development. But on moral issues--particularly sex, personal responsibility, and not handcuffing the justice system--brother!
Actually, I don't know where I fit on that spectrum. I'm both sex-obsessed and perverted. I love both red and blue, as well as purple and green. I'm a gun owner who loves the city, a moral absolutist and religious dogmatist and anti-abortionist who defends homosexual marriages and religious freedom for all. I love everything about France except the French. I support the War Against the Terror Masters.
So I voted for a write-in candidate whose signature appears as one of the Signers of the Declaration of Independence. I thought that was appropriate and it doesn't break my record of having voted in every Presidential election since reaching voting age.
And that Signer also happens to have the identical
surname and given name as that of himself. I think I need to get a gun.
Oh, and except for the gun owner part, he's pretty much described me, as well. Well, okay, maybe I'm not as sex-obsessed and perverted, but then, I'm not a man, either... *very big, very evil grin*
You brought up Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson in the same sentence using a level head about them. Yes, they are extreme at times, and I shake my head rolling my eyeballs around when one or the other speaks against issues that are very tender.
It made me think about the time I went to see my Mother and family in Virginia Beach. I wanted to go see the grounds of what Pat Robertson laid out through his life. I would listen to him on the 700 Club and liked many things he said. I remembered when he wanted to be president and some of the things, God told Him. He can grate on your nerves, that is for sure. I asked my Mom if she ever listened to him and she surprized me! "Well yes I do honey. I like his passion about our country and it's foundings. I believe in the ten commandments and Jesus. It's like CNN, and CBS, and the news stations I listen to. I have to weigh things out in my mind so I do like to watch the 700 Club." She is a staunch Democrat folks, really she was. Would not change her party for the world on a silver platter!
Some of my family felt I was nuts for wanting to go visit but it was my staunch democrat lil' Mom took me to her side and away we went. That place was awesome! People from all over the world visit there of all faiths. The college, the visitor's center with fine restaraunts and bookstores and more! I listened to his son give a sermon and sure did like him. So down to earth and love and concern for his fellow Americans. He reminded me of good ole' Billy Graham. A simple man just telling us that Jesus loved us.
Sometimes if you give a guy a break like Falwell, and Robertson you find out they have helped thousands of hurting souls. One thing I will give credit to Falwell is how quickly he will apologize when his mouth get's him in trouble and he realizes he is hurting instead of understanding and accepting as Jesus taught.
Yes, those Blue States are Mighty Fine States and it is true our roots were formed in those great states. I can go back in my mind when we had Kennedy and Bobby and Martin Luther. All of these men where christians, catholics. Our country was founded on Faith.
I do love what simple Max Lucado teaches us and I am so fortunate to be among those that got down on our knees when Max asked us to. We do have some outstanding democrats attending his establishment, well Our establishment.
My daughter was brought to tears many days leaving work. She would call me over the arguing she endured at work. She was a lone ranger there in the state capitol of Olympia, Washington. There were heated fights and then after the election she was really torn up. She would call me from her cell crying sitting in the ladies room on a nearby chair. "Mom, they told me they did not want a Christmas tree, what is going on. My stomach gets turned in knots. I would assure her that a christmas tree has always been a part of, Our American Tradition and to stand up to them by first talking with her boss. As the days would pass for her being the lone ranger, her boss found his daughter liked Bush too. She took the heat. Most of her co workers are good hard working democrats and she would be reminded that it was the democrats that helped her get her job. Welfare to work, plus she did not get her child support. She now is one of the heads of that division and she struggles with those that come and would rahter stay on welfare.
This hits home as I wrote above. This election was hard for all of us. I believe Max pointed out a danger when he said, America's God. He is 100% right on with that. God loves the world and he is not isolated to Americans. I want to uphold our freedoms and traditions like a simple Christmas Tree. My daughter did a fine job in standing firm and I told her that *listening* to the arguments is vital. Her values and traditions were vital.
There will be a Christmas tree in an office in Olympia, Washington again this year. A State office, imagine that! A pretty young daughter of mine managed to bridge the gap by first *listening*, and then explaining why a simple tree meant something called, Tradition here in America. "My President's Wife will decorate one!"
Catch 22 demonstrates what rigid liberal social beliefs are. I don't care what anyone does as long as they don't get in your face about it or tell me what their "rights" are. But the people who are moralists today are the Left. Try smoking in NY or many other cities. There is one liberal filled enclave near the capitol that tried to ban smoking in your own home. We all see the beginning of the PC gestapo trying to tell us what to eat, hell I don't care if their diet is all organic lettuce why should they care what I consume?
I don't see Hugh Heftner making out at Disneyland, is it too much to expect that my children shouldn't have to see the NAMBLA crowd demonstrating its affection in front of Mickey Mouse?
Finally I suggest you review your history. It was a requirement in all 13 colonies that you had to be a Christian to hold public office. I guess they had such laws because they wanted seperation of state and church, rather than insuring the State never instituted a government religion or prevented freedom of worship, right?
So there.
When it comes to taxes, I like fiscal responsibility and social spending that is economically smart, like Head Start and *ahem* socialized medicine. I would like to see the government run a long term balanced budget. I see the need for deficit spending during recessions, but I would to see us make it up during growing economies.
I believe in free trade and am against protectionism of every kind, except in developing economies, where I understand they sometimes need the shelter of a captive market to get their feet under them.
Even though my own industry (IT) is at stake, I am in favor of the free movement of labor and capital. I think the biggest problem with immigration is that there is not enough of it. I would like to see more legal immigration into America and either none or very little illegal immigration. I think the second class status of illegal immigrants brings us all down.
I think drug control laws are stupid, unenforcable, make a mockery of the legal system and are fundamentally immoral to boot. I believe this even though I smoked my last joint about 10 years ago.
I am not a Democrat or a Republican, though the recent turn of the Republican Party into a hegemon has made pretty anti-Republican. I tend to support the underdog in general and I think this is part of what liberalism is all about. Where the Democratic Party is dominant (like it is in San Francisco and California) I tend to work against it.
My upbringing was similar to Dean's but in different states: California and Wyoming. I find Dean's ideas and rhetoric strangely compelling, though I disagree with him over half the time.
I guess that is why I keep coming back.
Almost all the states over the next half-century or so wound up disestablishing their churches. The Baptists had a lot to do with that since they were always against state churches.
His birtfather was born in Cheyene, Wyoming. His dad took Dean and me to their, "Frontier Days", they hold yearly. Little Joe, Michael Landon came riding out on a exquisite white horse opening the Rodeo. Oh how excited I was and held Dean up high to sit on my shoulder. WOW, little Joe took a really cool ride all around the insides of the rodeo fences. Then he came riding fast and mighty towards me and Dean! He got off his horse and I though I would faint, afterall young 17 year old Mommies can giggle and feel a big blush. Joe, Michael took a look at Dean and thought Dean was so cute and patted his little head. Mom here, was thrilled.
Then you mention, California. My father, Dean's grandpa, ahh...Dean named him PaPah. Well, his Papah worked for, The San Francisco Chronicle. He came home from WWII and like many GI's, work was scarce and he got some dirty remarks from very crule and insensitive people. He heard word of San Francisco looking gor writer's. Daddy had a tremendous way with words and Always spoke through his words respecting both men and especially women. He would feel like cussing and he did from time to time but not in print. He needed the paper to grow or he could get booted out. He was a gentleman in manners but strong in mind, body and spirit. A lot of papers were sold during his tenure there. People came up to him on the street teeling him he was such a decent man with honesty and integrity. They loved the way he tried to describe the war and how proud he was to serve this country.
I remember seeing many Frontier Days when I was young. The Grandaddy of Them All, as they like to call it.