Good Lord. Have you read about the Delaney Clause, which seeks to ban any product found to cause cancer in laboratory mice? In practically any dosage?
As Rand Simberg correctly points out, many things which are toxic at certain dosages are harmless or even beneficial at lower levels. Although he doesn't say so, I'll point out that you'll die without iron in your diet, and you'll die from too much iron in your diet. Arsenic is quite poisonous, but there's some evidence that tiny trace quantities of it may be healthy. Too much vitamin A is poisonous, and too little of it will mess you up. And so on.
You can almost see this train wreck coming, though. Can't you? Efforts to modify it will be portrayed as just another effort to "poison the people to help the big corporations." Despicable. When did environmentalism stop being associated with common sense?
Sigh.
Potassium.
Chloride.
Sodium.
Glucose.
All beneficial AND harmful. Depending how much, when and how it's given/taken.
Not the arsenic thing again, Dean?
Sigh.
Colloidal Minerals: arsenic as necessary nutrient.
Dietary Reference Intakes: Vitamin K, arsenic, boron, chromium, copper, iodine, iron, manganese, molybdenum, nickel, silicon, vanadium, and zinc, all of which are toxic at excessive dosage, but all of which appear to be necessary for health.
By the way, in the battle against syphilis, Salvarsan, which means "I Save," was one of the most effective treatments developed in the 20th century. It was an effective replacement for the mercury-based treatments used before it, which did work but were less effective.
Geez. All meat and meat by-products are carcinogenic in high doses over time. Does this mean that our government is going to enforce Veganism on the populace?
No, thank you. I'd rather move to Islamabad and wear a burkha!
Saliva has also been found to cause cancer.
But, only if swallowed in small quantities over
long periods of time.
I read your links. Herre's what they said:
Numerous studies with rats, hamsters, mini pigs, goats, and chicks have provided cumstantial evidence suggesting that arsenic is essential, but its physiological role has not been clearly defined. Recent work, however, indicates that arsenic may have a role in methionine metabolism.
...and this:
Arsenic in chemical forms is a known toxic element, but not enough data exist on chronic intakes at lower levels from food and supplements to set a U[pper] L[imit].
As for your story about sexually transmitted diseases being cured by this toxic substance, well, let's just say I want to be there when your candidate uses the word "syphillis" and "arsenic" in the same sentence.
Hee. Go ahead, make my day! Please.
This must be a product of that all-powerful Mouse Lobby... damn that Disney!
There are countless known substances with insufficient study available to establish safe upper limits. Some are better studied than others. Chromium, arsenic, and boron are all good examples. Arsenic in particular is one that all humans ingest; the average American gets 25-50 nanograms daily, if I recall correctly.
Useful medicines often include substances which are poisonous in higher dosages.
There's nothing controversial in any of the above statements.
"Toxic substance," however, as the article Rand Simberg linked to suggests, is increasingly more of a political term than a scientific one.
There's nothing controversial in any of the above statements.
Um, I forgot -- tell me again why arsenic is good for me??
And, of course...as measurement technology improves, concentrations which were once undetectable can now be measured.
It's not clear that it's good for you, although there's some evidence that it's helpful. That's not a hedge, either; it's a statement of the scientific knowledge to date.
Low serum arsenic is correlated with central nervous system disorders, vascular disease, and cancer. Others indicate that it may play a role in metabolizing certain other substances. Of course, correlation is not causation, and further research may yield different answers.
The problem in human nutrition is that a host of these issues are poorly understood and poorly investigated. It's a field that doesn't receive anywhere near enough funding, frankly. But to give other examples:
Chromium is now generally acknowledged to be a necessary mineral for insulin production and sensitivity. Yet exact daily allowances are not established, and a safe upper daily limit is not known.
Check any multivitamin/multimineral tablet. You will find substances on it listed with asterisks saying that a recommended allowance is not established. The more "complete" the supplement, the more "toxic substances" will be in it. Just to start it will probably include potassium and iron, both of which are "toxic substances."
Some of the more complete multimineral supplements will include "toxic substances" such as boron, molybdenum, selenium, chromium, and vanadium. All are known to be toxic at some level. Most are generally acknowledged to be safe at some level and possibly vital to nutrition at some level. The science on any of it is not firmly established.
Certain foods contain trace amounts of cyanide, too. Does that shock you?
You can lead people around the nose forever by scaring them about "toxic substances." But the fact of the matter is that you have been ingesting things like arsenic on a daily basis for your entire life, and you will continue to ingest it on a daily basis until the day you die. Nor is it humanly possible to get all arsenic out of anyone's food or water supply.
Therefore, in any question regarding issues like this, the question is not "is this potentially toxic?" The answer is frequently "yes," to thousands of things you ingest every day. The real question is, what is a safe level of risk, and what are the relative cost/benefit ratios of trying to make yourself "safer" from something you understand poorly?
This is the difference between rationalists and reactionaries, by the way.
Dietary arsenic (As) is thought to have a physiological role affecting the sulfur amino acid methionine. These findings suggest that arsenic could be important in the formation of methionine from its precursor homocysteine.
There are two ways by which methionine can be formed from homocysteine. One pathway needs the vitamin folic acid. The other pathway needs the vitamin. A study suggests that dietary arsenic affects the formation of methionine from homocysteine.
The data shows that arsenic-deprived rats fed low amounts of folic acid cannot as efficiently make more methionine. This suggests that arsenic has a physiological role that could be important to maintain adequate amounts of methionine in the body. This data supports the notion that a small amount of arsenic is needed by humans.
FYI: Methionine is one of the essential amino acids (building blocks of protein), meaning that it cannot be produced by the body, and must be provided by the diet. It supplies sulfur and other compounds required by the body for normal metabolism and growth. Methionine also belongs to a group of compounds called lipotropics, or chemicals that help the liver process fats.
As scientists say, "the dose makes the poison."
The question I have is, how do we get the politics out of questions like this? It drives me batty.
Rose:
Answer this question please:
Is arsenic a necessary nutrient, without which my health will suffer?
Just answer yes or no please.
I have several other questions for you after you answer that one.
Studies point to...Yes.
Yes or no, please:
Are there any homeopathic remedies that involve ingesting arsenic?
More questions coming...
What do you want, Rubyan? Egg in your beer?
It is a fact that arsenic plays a role in human nutrition. You'll find arsenic in shellfish, garlic, apples, and quite a few other common foods. It's highly poisonous in some quantities, but is believed to play a benign and likely positive role in human health in minute quantities. Like many micronutrients, it's not completely understood, and that's all we know
What is your obsession with this issue?
They execute criminals with potassium sulfate. You can also go to any food store and buy potassium sulfate tablets, or potassium salts, as a dietary supplement, and you get a good jolt of the stuff if you eat a banana. So what?
The phrase is "the dose makes the poison." What's so complicated about that?
The author of the Delaney clause has taken literally the well known popular slogan:
"Education is expensive!? Why not try ignorance?"
The author of the Delaney clause has taken literally the well known popular slogan:
"Education is expensive!? Why not try ignorance?"
dsl angebot dsl dsl dsl tarife dsl flatrate isdn xxl dsl bestellen dsl dsl flatrate dsl dsl dsl angebote 1&1
I enjoyed reading this thoughtful article. Great work.
Interesting, well researched and informative, but I'm not sure I totally agree